In this episode we talk with Jake from Rio Mobility about the  Next Generation Firefly Electric Handcycle Attachment for Wheelchairs. Jake gives us the backstory of Rio Mobility and explains in depth how the Firefly Electric Handcycle works and what they are planning for the future.

Living Spinal Podcast - Episode 1

Video Interview with Jake from Rio Mobility about the Firefly Wheelchair Attachment

Show Notes: The links will open in a new tab

Living Spinal Facebook Group with over 2,800 members

Blumil Seated Self-Balancing Products

Next Generation Firefly Electric Handcycle Attachment for Wheelchairs from Rio Mobility

The American History Museum has World Population Growth Estimate

Disabilities Parking App on  iTunes and on Google Play

Transcription of the interview with Rio Mobility and the Firefly for Wheelchairs:

Rio Mobility Interview

David: We're here with Jake and he works with Rio Mobility. We have a few questions to ask Jake and learn more about Rio Mobility and about the next generation firefly that just came out. We've seen the progression of the firefly over the past five years and seen the next generation Firefly spurred us on to actually get a hold of you guys. And kind I learn more about it. What have been the biggest changes between the two generations?

Jake: So, the first generation actually has the four point attachment and our second generation now has a two point attachment which would hopefully be more convenient to users and it's also a little bit lighter and it just looks sleeker compared to our older version.

David: Yeah that's what we noticed too. Andrew was talking about it to me a little earlier but like the modular setup compared to the old one. This one, it's in different parts, you've got the body, you can even take off the battery really easy to make it a little bit lighter to put in the back of your car you can detach a little attachment that goes to your wheelchair. So it's way easier to just load up even the back of like a convertible.

Andrew: I think it's a huge aspect of it because, myself being a wheelchair user, you’re not always the most stable person in the world, different users have different core capabilities and so if you can break that thing down into being multiple different smaller weight aspects to it. It really makes it easier to be able to manage yourself which is a really big deal when it comes to mobility products for wheelchair users

Jake: It’s a lot more portable than an electric scooter, that's for sure.

Andrew: Definitely.

David: So can you, Jake, can you give us like a background of Rio mobility for people who are completely new to the wheelchair world, haven't heard of it before

Jake: So, Rio Mobility we got the name from cause Rio means river in Spanish. You know, a river provides to a community and is always constantly moving. So just like our Firefly we want to help people in the wheelchair community, by providing them with, you know, more mobility, freedom and Independence.

David: Where did the concept come from? Was it first an idea or did he see it before with a different product and he wanted to make it better?

Jake: So I spoke to a C.E.O. about this. He actually went to a trade show in Germany. That's where he saw a couple of similar products and from there . That's where he came up with the Firefly and also the Pivot and Dragonfly.

David: What are the other products?

Jake: So it would be the Pivot, which is a lever propulsion system and Dragonfly which is almost like, I guess you can say a bicycle, but then you're using your you know your hands to propel yourself and then also the power assist firefly.

David: I know he really struck a chord with a lot of people in a great way because a lot of people love the Firefly, like we were at the ‘Abilities Expo’ last year in L.A. and we came into a restaurant and there were Fireflys all over the place.

Jake: Oh wow, that's pretty awesome, I see them from time to time, you know, whether it's at the mall or on the streets and crazy sight to see, it catch everyone's attention, it’s a head turner.

David: Right Yeah. I know that my personal experience with the previous generation Firefly, it was a little cumbersome trying to get the attachment points to connect, you know in four places, because it had to take like, your full mental concentration to attach and it once it was attached it was perfect. It was great. It works well in really like, tight corners and stuff so when you're in grocery stores or whatever it's easy to get around but I'm really glad that you guys addressed that. You just like hop in, attach it, clamp it, and then you know push it up, so that you can keep rolling.

Jake: Well yeah I mean it goes wherever you want to go.

Andrew: So I think one of the great aspects of the new brackets too, is that with the four points like David was saying it really gave it more opportunities to bind up. Where is now, with just two, you click and go. Also, the user does not have to reach down as far and certainly a number of users that either cannot reach down or maybe they're a little bit overweight and their stomach is like obstructing them from getting all the way down there, it was a little bit difficult on the old model and the new model has totally taken care of that so they can get to it up high and not have to struggle or in a situation they don't want to be in.

David: I was looking at the digital control center. The whole handlebars and acceleration, deceleration and you get really focused on making it more quadriplegic friendly..

Jake: Yeah.

David: Can you explain a little bit more how the levers work and how it would benefit someone who's a quadriplegic?

Jake: Yes, so instead of the throttle where you would have to twist on the older one. Now you just have to push the lever, which is a lot easier.

Andrew: Yeah absolutely.

David: And that's forward and reverse, right?

Andrew: Yeah it's kind of a quicker ability to go in reverse. I remember the old one and almost all other models in the world. They don't have reverse at all or you have to go forward and then stop all the way and switch it in reverse. Now you've literally got a button on either side for forward and reverse. Love the design.

Jake: Definitely trying to make it as simple as possible. And as user friendly as possible as well.

David: Do you have an industry that you guys look at for inspiration?

Jake: Well, a lot of the Firefly parts and components are actually bicycle parts. So you know we're always looking at the bicycle industry and also the wheelchair industry as well, to make sure our product you know is compatible with multiple wheelchairs because there are so many wheelchairs out there.

David: That is a good approach because if you're looking at some weird like, aerospace industry or something where parts are hard to come across, it's not practical for people. You can pick up a lot of these parts from a bike shop or at least order them at a bike shop makes it so much easier for people day to day.

Andrew: And maintenance, a lot of people are not in a situation where they're mechanically inclined or anything but they can go to any local bike shop and have them work on those new disk brakes. You know, have them work on replacing, you know the components like hand brakes and everything. So, I like the whole bicycle aspect. It's a smart move to use products. There are already in the industry and are tried and true.

David: I know that, every business has its own different departments, but did you have a hand in any of the prototyping of this next generation or did you, get any feedback from the C.E.O. as he was working on it?

Jake : So I personally did not do any of the prototyping but we do have a new product coming out called ‘E-dragon Fly’ and we should be releasing that sometime next year so in regards to all the other prototypes I know he came up with a lot and did a lot of testing but in regards to details, I'm not too sure.

Andrew: That would be an electric Handcycle assist.

Jake: Yes exactly.

Andrew: Very cool.

David: Yeah I know that we've had people asking about that, when we go to some of these expos and we have people rolling around on the Dragonfly or the Firefly.

Andrew: I have to say, your company, Rio Mobility, the Firefly the Dragonfly, they've really been some of our top selling products on ‘Livingspinal.com’ and we appreciate working hand in hand with you guys for years now, and it's been pretty fun to be able to show customers our relationship and the way that we can help out, as a manufacturer it’s really hard for you guys to work with everybody to get all the answers in situations, whether it's maintenance or brand new person that wants to purchase one and we love to be there for your customers and get them through Livingspinal.com and get answers out there to them.

Jake: Definitely couldn't agree with you more

David: And just to toot our own horn, we have a killer product page for the Next Generation Firefly. So, for people listening or watching this video. We will put a link at the bottom of the page, videos, installation videos, break down of all the specifications, a bunch of zoomed in pictures and so on that you're not going to find on really any other websites. Also just kind of getting back into the story of different customers that have brought the Firefly. Are there any stories that you can tell us about customers who have maybe travelled to a foreign land with a Firefly or maybe somebody who struggled to get a Firefly some point, and then they found a creative way to purchase one?

Jake: Yes, so since my time here, I have actually spoken to a lot of Firefly users, and I mean they couldn't enjoy more. They always tell me what a huge impact it's had on their life that gave them their independence. Particularly yesterday, a woman stopped by and told her that she was able to take her firefly to Amsterdam with her, on the trip. You know she had a blast. She was able to hop into the bike lanes because the maximum speed is 12 miles per hour on the Firefly and was also able to tackle those cobble roads too.

Andrew: I personally went to Amsterdam myself with the Firefly.

Jake: So you know how it is.

Andrew: Yes, so the trade show that you were talking about in Germany is Rehacare, and I went to that as well and brought a firefly with me you know there's no better place to be on a bicycle than Amsterdam and there are bikes everywhere. To be a part of that and do it out on Firefly was a real special thing for me too.

David: I was wondering if there are any products out there, that you're excited about, like stuff that works really well with the Firefly or the Dragonfly?

Jake: You know, I was actually checking out some videos yesterday. I’m actually looking at some robotic exo skeleton. That's something that's you know caught my eye, I think in the near future. You know maybe that will be the new thing.

Andrew: We're noticing a trend with some of these electric hand cycles is some of the ways to add suspension to your wheelchair. So traditionally you had to buy a frame that was more expensive and had shocks built in, which created the frame to be a little heavier whereas now we actually have a couple options in industry two of which that we sell are, the SoftWheels and the LoopWheels. So, it's a suspension system built into the wheels for the back of the wheelchair. So you know when you're pushing your Firefly to the limit going off road doing different things, jumping off curbs because it's really easy to go down a curb with the Firefly, you can add suspension to the back of your chair and really create an off road experience, without injuring your back or helping give yourself a little bit more comfort. So, that's been a real awesome product for us to tie along with and I think is a neat thing to associate with Firefly.

Jake: Oh yeah that sounds great. I mean what can be better than you know adding to a wheelchair and having a smoother ride along with the Firefly.

David: Right, cause like a lot of people are limited, when they first buy their wheelchair to deciding should I pay the extra eleven hundred bucks or like three thousand bucks for suspension, or should I just get it without suspension and save the cash? Keep your wheelchair light when you want it to be light.

Andrew: When you're getting in your car the heaviest aspect of your wheelchair is your frame. So to add the suspension on to the frame, which is already the toughest thing to bring into the car with you, whereas the wheels are easy. So add a pound on to the wheels is no big deal.

David: Yeah and that goes right back to the core of what's new about the next generation Firefly, Modular, right? You know, lifting a small amount of weight at a time

Andrew: Have you guys looked at making any models with a larger front wheel. I know you guys have actually downsized a little bit in the front wheel size, which changes your off road capabilities a bit but definitely makes it easier to handle and lighter weight.

Jake: So yes, so we actually transition to the 12” wheel from the 16” because we did a lot of tests and I spoke to the engineers and they said it's really not that big of a difference, performance wise, when comparing the 12” to 16” wheel. Some people have in mind that maybe a sixteen inch your wheel will be big and you’re gonna go faster than having a 12 inch, but it's the same speed.

David: Yeah, right

Andrew: The feature, that I really love is in the past models like in the first generation. The headlight was out and exposed and when you're calling that thing and thrown it in another you car and stuff it was pretty easy to damage it whereas in the next generation. Now you guys have really done a nice job hiding that headlight and putting it in a protected space so that there's no damage there. So great design aspect improvement there.

Jake: Thank you.

David: Yeah, I think overall it looks like sleeker and cooler than the last generation.

Andrew: As far is range. If you're a big guy like me or some little lady around one hundred pounds, what kind of distance are you seeing, out of most users?

Jake: Oh yeah with the Firefly you can easily push 15 miles or so per charge.

Andrew: Wow yeah, that's a long ways. You can go quite a way. That's a half marathon right there. Are there any aspects about the battery that you changed? I believe the new battery is a thirty six volt system. A big thing that I would love to touch on is, your recommendation for how to charge it because that's a huge issue and the something that is important to get out to users, and a potential future users, because it's an expensive part of the unit and we all know if you don't take care, your batteries will just you know go down the drain. So what can you tell us about your recommendations and what you talk customers for? How to charge and the best way to get the longest life out of your battery?

Jake: So definitely keep it at room temperature. Don't want to keep it in any freezing temperatures or in the garage or anything like that

Andrew: Oh, I’ve been putting mine in freezer every night. I'm going to stop doing that.

David: Also, if you leave the battery in your car, your car could get up one hundred twenty degrees or something like that. While you can just take the battery out if you know you want to keep your Firefly in your car and bring the battery in your house and charge it.

Jake: But we usually recommend to charge it overnight and all it takes four hours a charge. So not too long. You know, if you're gone for like a certain period of time like on vacation, we don't recommend just leaving it plugged in.

Andrew: So, basically charge it for four hours. Some batteries their life cycle, you don't want to let that thing just drain and the get down to nothing. Is that the way that this one is or do you want to kill the whole battery and then charge it up? Kill the battery and charge it up?

Jake: In the beginning, that's what you wanna do. As you use in a little bit more, you don't really have to do that. We haven't had any problems with the recent batteries

Andrew: My last question would be, sometimes a user will get in a funk where maybe they haven't used it in a while. What would be the longest time that you would recommend to leave the battery before charging it? So, at least once a month get a charge on your battery.

Jake: I would even say two weeks, just to play it safe. These batteries are quite expensive to replace. So I would recommend you know, every two weeks or at least a month.

Andrew: Well, That’s a great advice. Thank you very much.

David: Cool, Jake. Well, thank you. We really do appreciate your time and what you guys are doing for the paralysis community, wheelchair community. We’re really glad to talk to you. So hopefully this will help a lot of people.

Jake: Yeah definitely

Andrew: yeah great man and we'll talk to you later,

Jake: Sounds good.

Thank you. Bye.